Philosophy Discussion Forums | A Humans-Only Club for Open-Minded Discussion & Debate

[Sculptor1]

I cannot prove that Santa does not exist.

Can anyone?

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Santa "Clause" did exist.

Saint Nicholas was known for his generosity and kindness, which gave rise to legends of miracles he performed for the poor and unhappy. As a result of this reputation, devotion to Nicholas extended to all parts of Europe. He became the patron saint of multiple countries, of charitable fraternities and guilds, and of children, sailors, unmarried girls, merchants, and pawnbrokers.

Jesus existed as well
There are records, outside of the Bible that speak of Jesus- this includes Greek scholars and Roman soldiers
First, both Josephus and Lucian indicate that Jesus was regarded as wise. Second, Pliny, the Talmud, and Lucian imply He was a powerful and revered teacher. Third, both Josephus and the Talmud indicate He performed miraculous feats. Fourth, Tacitus, Josephus, the Talmud, and Lucian all mention that He was crucified. Tacitus and Josephus say this occurred under Pontius Pilate. And the Talmud declares it happened on the eve of Passover. Fifth, there are possible references to the Christian belief in Jesus' resurrection in both Tacitus and Josephus. Sixth, Josephus records that Jesus' followers believed He was the Christ, or Messiah. And finally, both Pliny and Lucian indicate that Christians worshipped Jesus as God.

Santa Claus did not exist. There once was a man called Nicholas, is not the same as saying he was a deity capable of routine miracles; which is what is meant by "Sata Claus".
You can same the same about Jesus of Nazareth. "Christ" did not exist. He was not the Messiah he was just a very naughty boy.

What you have demonstrated here is the paucity of such threads which make absurd claims and ridiculous statements about vague and diffuse ideas. Such as "Atheism is illogical", and this thread

The level of rigor in such threads is low ro absent.
In order to state "God is impossible" it is necessary to define what is meant by such a diffuse term as "god".
How many definitions could you devise?? Surely picking one, and making a clear statement about what it means would be the first step to engaging people in a valuable discussion?

[Mounce574]

Using science, can you logically state there is no God?
Religion is man-made- the leaders of the churches (Catholic, Methodist, etc) are the ones who set their rules. Honestly, God didn't state the rules outside the bible.


Without God, what is the reason for life? What caused life? What happens to a person when they die? Why are we alive?

[Sy Borg]

Using science, can you logically state there is no God?

I can say logically that the anthropomorphic deities of antiquity are metaphors, not actual entities.

Honestly, God didn't state the rules outside the bible.

Nor in it. Men wrote it. Much of it was written hundreds of years after the purported events, many of which have since been proven untrue. This is no surprise because, without proper record-keeping, stories become distorted.

Honestly, God didn't state the rules outside the bible.

Without God, what is the reason for life?[/quote]
Then again, why need deities to want to live? Wouldn't you find life enjoyable without believing in your Middle Eastern deity?

What caused life?

Our planet did, although the difference between complex biochemistry and the first biology was probably small. Everything is alive in its way, but there are emergences.

What happens to a person when they die?

No one knows. Oh well. No sense pretending that we know when we clearly don't.

Why are we alive?

Your mother and father either wanted a child, or they messed up.

[Belindi]

Extract from Mounce v Sy Borg:

Mounce574 wrote: ↑What happens to a person when they die?
(Sy Borg):No one knows. Oh well. No sense pretending that we know when we clearly don't.

By "person" it seems that Mounce frames his ideas within the existence of an individual as made up of separable body and immortal soul.

Immortal soul is usually conceived of as retaining the personality of the body/soul combination. Mounce therefore should make it clear how personality, which changes during a lifespan, can survive bodily death

[3017Metaphysician]

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Cool! Did he tell you that he existed?

Yes, he came to me and spoke to me. He told me that I had been a good-ish girl but, due to my lack of interest in material goods, I won't be receiving any presents, in accordance with my wishes. Later on, I got to speak with Santa, and he agreed.

Hahaha! You know SB, you have an endearing witty, scintillating side! Such a nice 'quality'! You know, like those quality-of-life- things I'm trying to get you to understand!

[Sy Borg]

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Cool! Did he tell you that he existed?

Yes, he came to me and spoke to me. He told me that I had been a good-ish girl but, due to my lack of interest in material goods, I won't be receiving any presents, in accordance with my wishes. Later on, I got to speak with Santa, and he agreed.

Hahaha! You know SB, you have an endearing witty, scintillating side! Such a nice 'quality'! You know, like those quality-of-life- things I'm trying to get you to understand!

:lol:

One does not need to treat the metaphorical ideas of Middle Eastern Iron Age mythology as literal truth to have quality of life. One can respect the mythology for what it was, and attempt to understand the metaphors and poetry of ancient expression, and it's a shame that misguided literalism and interference with state affairs has created hostility towards what should be seen as a fascinating slice of the worlds rich mythological tapestry.

Having long been fascinated with evolution, I enjoy Plato's great chain of being, since co-opted by the mediaeval church. People have long noticed a sense of progression in nature, with different entities displaying differing degrees of awareness. I think that the primary angels - the cherubim, thrones and seraphim - could be awesome in a mythological adventure a la Clash of the Titans or Jason and the Argonauts. Alas, such a movie would be cancelled by Christians.

[Mounce574]

What makes everyone's brain different- even twins think differently from the same set of parents. My sister and I were raised by the same parents with the same rules. Why is she extroverted and I am introverted? Why do we have different lifestyles- she is married to another woman, and I am single and would never date a woman (I believe there are only two genders and I am a woman).
When we die, what happens to your soul?
Why did we evolve and yet other beings did not? Why do I share 98% of my biology with a banana?

[LuckyR]

What makes everyone's brain different- even twins think differently from the same set of parents. My sister and I were raised by the same parents with the same rules. Why is she extroverted and I am introverted? Why do we have different lifestyles- she is married to another woman, and I am single and would never date a woman (I believe there are only two genders and I am a woman).
When we die, what happens to your soul?
Why did we evolve and yet other beings did not? Why do I share 98% of my biology with a banana?

Do you mean besides genetics?

[Mounce574]

Genetics are exactly the same- why does that make each child different? I gave the example of my sister and myself. Physically and mentally we are not alike. She is 5'8 blonde hair blue eyes, I am 5'3 black hair, and brown eyes. The same parents, we were raised the same way. Why are we completely different in personality and mental capabilities? If God does not exist to create consciousness and mental abilities to make each person an individual being, then wouldn't we all be exactly alike?

Science is fallible in many ways. Darwin even stated that his theories on evolution were wrong. A theory is used to create a possible answer but it is not a fact. I fail to believe that the energy required to create Earth existed because there is no explanation as to where that energy comes from. And just causing the planet didn't create life. The thought that we evolved either from an amoeba or a monkey makes no sense since those things still exist. Why did some evolve but others remained stagnant in the form they are now?

[Belindi]

What makes everyone's brain different- even twins think differently from the same set of parents. My sister and I were raised by the same parents with the same rules. Why is she extroverted and I am introverted? Why do we have different lifestyles- she is married to another woman, and I am single and would never date a woman (I believe there are only two genders and I am a woman).
When we die, what happens to your soul?
Why did we evolve and yet other beings did not? Why do I share 98% of my biology with a banana?

You are not immortal. There is no such object as an immortal soul. When you die there will be no more Mounce. What does remain after Mounce dies is what happened with Mounce during the time and place of Mounce.
What happened can't un-happen.

Humans evolved because the ones that were strong enough to live to be old enough to have babies tended to have strong babies. The same with other wild species; individuals that were strong enough to survive until they could have babies tended to produce stronger babies.

The differences between you and your sister is one example of the huge variety of human individuals, even when they come from the same parents.
If you have ever owned a pedigree dog, horse, cow, or cat you will know that what pedigree you chose will be as described by the breeder. No humans are pedigree individuals because no human is bred to be the same as another human, and I think it's actually illegal in most countries to try to do this.

The parents of you and your sister have or had a huge number of genes, and it's matter of luck which of your parents' genes got to be Mounce and which got to be Mounce's sister.

[LuckyR]

Genetics are exactly the same- why does that make each child different? I gave the example of my sister and myself. Physically and mentally we are not alike. She is 5'8 blonde hair blue eyes, I am 5'3 black hair, and brown eyes. The same parents, we were raised the same way. Why are we completely different in personality and mental capabilities? If God does not exist to create consciousness and mental abilities to make each person an individual being, then wouldn't we all be exactly alike?

Science is fallible in many ways. Darwin even stated that his theories on evolution were wrong. A theory is used to create a possible answer but it is not a fact. I fail to believe that the energy required to create Earth existed because there is no explanation as to where that energy comes from. And just causing the planet didn't create life. The thought that we evolved either from an amoeba or a monkey makes no sense since those things still exist. Why did some evolve but others remained stagnant in the form they are now?

Well, it is charming to witness the original purpose of gods in action in the Modern day. You don't understand the causes of certain observations, so in the absence of a known (to you) physical explanation, there must be a metaphysical explanation. Voila, a god could be the cause. The case is solved. Everything fits.

[Belindi]

Genetics are exactly the same- why does that make each child different? I gave the example of my sister and myself. Physically and mentally we are not alike. She is 5'8 blonde hair blue eyes, I am 5'3 black hair, and brown eyes. The same parents, we were raised the same way. Why are we completely different in personality and mental capabilities? If God does not exist to create consciousness and mental abilities to make each person an individual being, then wouldn't we all be exactly alike?

Science is fallible in many ways. Darwin even stated that his theories on evolution were wrong. A theory is used to create a possible answer but it is not a fact. I fail to believe that the energy required to create Earth existed because there is no explanation as to where that energy comes from. And just causing the planet didn't create life. The thought that we evolved either from an amoeba or a monkey makes no sense since those things still exist. Why did some evolve but others remained stagnant in the form they are now?

Well, it is charming to witness the original purpose of gods in action in the Modern day. You don't understand the causes of certain observations, so in the absence of a known (to you) physical explanation, there must be a metaphysical explanation. Voila, a god could be the cause. The case is solved. Everything fits.

Mounce does at least ask questions, which I hope means she is teachable.

[Jacob10]

God is not an impossibility if there are two different opinions that can’t be cancelled out.

[LuckyR]

God is not an impossibility if there are two different opinions that can’t be cancelled out.

How can an entity without a universally agreed upon definition be impossible?

[Jacob10]

God is not an impossibility if there are two different opinions that can’t be cancelled out.

How can an entity without a universally agreed upon definition be impossible?

Something exists if opinions still remain or else there would be a cancelling out of opinions and there would be silence.Something doesn’t cease to exist because it is silent.

That doesn’t mean that that something is necessarily alive.

A biological computer brain is a machine with dualistic reasoning because it doesn’t know whether it exists or not with it’s binary programming. It is only an organ after all.

Dualistic processing/reasoning is a reality.