Philosophy Discussion Forums | A Humans-Only Club for Open-Minded Discussion & Debate

[Sushan]

Computer, some, has windows program, so we do, human,..., stress is one of this program.

Stress make sure, something important gets done. What is important to us we always make this decision in our head.

Process you assess: you can do it - "good stress", you assess: to much a diference between you capabilities, time, and what has to be done,...then nature pushes you in anger or you are starting to back off with help, stories,...

But the question is where is a challenge, which is most powerful healthy thing, you done more, you are happier, healthier - dont forget to eat and sleep.

Stress makes you physically ill, the point of that is, if you dont get through exam in school is gona hurts you, so i - nature i am hearting you, so i will make sure things which are important gets done. Nature tells you, done this thing and i wont hurt you.

Challenge, sit down figure it out what you really want to do in life, not in 5years, not in 25 years, but when you die you are doing, or you done this thing, only this way you get your keyboard of challenge in your hand, if not STRESS "good" and "bad".

All our actions have consequences. Some are due to commission and some are due to omission. You have to pass your exams to complete your degree (commission). You should not steal because it is illegal and you will be in jail (omission). If you are going to do the opposite in any of these situations, yes, you will be in trouble. And that knowledge of the possible consequence will (definitely should) produce some stress in you, and it will either encourage or discourage you accordingly. So stress can be an encouragement as well as a protective factor depending on the scenario.

[Sushan]

I am sorry but I do not understand your attempt to prove that psychiatrists go for wrong and cheap medication while a patient can be offered with other therapies like counseling, CBT, etc.

99% of people with mental health problems are dependant on the state for help, since being mad means you tend not to be able to afford private care.
This is what we call a no brainer.

Yes, there are various treatment modalities in psychiatry. But that does not mean all patients are eligible to everything. Some can be treated simply by counseling or CBT, but some need oral medication. Some has to be given IV or IM medication and some need to be subjected to Electro Convulsive Therapy. And all these therapies have a scientific basis.

Let me take another example. If we consider cardiology, myocardial infarction is a critical condition that we see in this speciality. Treatment options can be listed as giving Enoxaparin, Streptokinase, Tenecteplase, etc. But the eligibility depends in individual patient conditions. Some may not need any treatment other than supportive treatment and rehabilitation, but some might need surgery. It is up to the clinician to choose accordingly, so in psychiatry as well.

I'm not sure if you are just naive, or just an optimist.
The "tendancy" of which I speak is a fact of life for millions of people, and the existence of other treatments does not change my statement.

In my country healthcare system is totally free including mental healthcare.

Where is that?
That claim is also true where I live. And that is exactly why I say that there is a tendancy to drug rather than offer more expensive treatments.

Sri Lanka.

I will not speak about the private ssector since various treatment modalities will have various price tags on them. But in government sector, whether it is a drug or a counselling session or a CBT session, all these are paid not by the patient but by the government. So the only limiting factor is the availability of resources. Clinicians are not separately paid for doing counselling or CBT since it is a part of their job. And also they are not paid for seeing a huge number of patients quickly by easily prescribing drugs. So the appropriate treatments are offered to patients without charging directly from their pockets (Nothing can be free in a state and that is why we pay taxes. But I think that is a different topic and it is totally different from paying your medical bills directly from your pocket).

[LuckyR]

So these folks had no history of depression, suffered a stressful situation, naturally felt sad, then later after the stress was lifted continued on to clinical depression?

The stressor may have been lifted physically, but the person might have been having the mental ssuffering throughout the time despite his/her family being very much supportive.

One example was about a law student who was diagnosed with depression following a relationship breakup. She had no psychiatric history, and her traceable family history also was clear from any psychiatric illness. She was a bright student until she came to the university, fell in love, and finally ended up in a breakup. Then she started to act wierdly and all her academic performances reduced. Then it continued to become a widespread unhappiness which affected her day to life as well. Ultimately she was diagnosed with clinical depression without psychotic symptoms, and I happened to meet her in the asylum for the mentally ill people.

No doubt because clinical depression can have it's onset at any age and since life stressors are common, there are going to be individuals (like your example) who note a correlation in timing between a particular life stress and the onset of their disease. However such correlation is not de facto causation.

The real cause for many psychiatric illnesses are still not clear. And that is why the term 'multifactorial' is used. I agree that the correlation can very well be a mere coincidence. But when we consider most of the stories related to clinical Depression, there is a high amount of associated stressful and depressive events. So, though it may not be de facto causation, I think it is quite unfair and even be harmful to reject the relevance and relationship between stressors and depression.

I think almost everyone agrees there is a direct link between life stressors and sadness. These feelings of sadness may be indistinguishable from the feelings of depression. Though one of the hallmarks of depression is the presence or persistance of the feelings in the absence of an external cause.

Some may theorize that external stressors can change neurotransmitter levels permanently and thus bring on depression, others put stressors and their resultant sadness in one box and neurotransmitter levels and their resultant depression in a separate silo (acknowledging that both can make an individual feel similarly in the moment).

[Sculptor1]

99% of people with mental health problems are dependant on the state for help, since being mad means you tend not to be able to afford private care.
This is what we call a no brainer.


I'm not sure if you are just naive, or just an optimist.
The "tendancy" of which I speak is a fact of life for millions of people, and the existence of other treatments does not change my statement.

In my country healthcare system is totally free including mental healthcare.

Where is that?
That claim is also true where I live. And that is exactly why I say that there is a tendancy to drug rather than offer more expensive treatments.

Sri Lanka.

I will not speak about the private ssector since various treatment modalities will have various price tags on them. But in government sector, whether it is a drug or a counselling session or a CBT session, all these are paid not by the patient but by the government. So the only limiting factor is the availability of resources. Clinicians are not separately paid for doing counselling or CBT since it is a part of their job. And also they are not paid for seeing a huge number of patients quickly by easily prescribing drugs. So the appropriate treatments are offered to patients without charging directly from their pockets (Nothing can be free in a state and that is why we pay taxes. But I think that is a different topic and it is totally different from paying your medical bills directly from your pocket).

Sri Lanka has the highest suicide rate in the world.
So I guess your mental health services are not working too well, eh?

[LuckyR]

In my country healthcare system is totally free including mental healthcare.

Where is that?
That claim is also true where I live. And that is exactly why I say that there is a tendancy to drug rather than offer more expensive treatments.

Sri Lanka.

I will not speak about the private ssector since various treatment modalities will have various price tags on them. But in government sector, whether it is a drug or a counselling session or a CBT session, all these are paid not by the patient but by the government. So the only limiting factor is the availability of resources. Clinicians are not separately paid for doing counselling or CBT since it is a part of their job. And also they are not paid for seeing a huge number of patients quickly by easily prescribing drugs. So the appropriate treatments are offered to patients without charging directly from their pockets (Nothing can be free in a state and that is why we pay taxes. But I think that is a different topic and it is totally different from paying your medical bills directly from your pocket).

Sri Lanka has the highest suicide rate in the world.
So I guess your mental health services are not working too well, eh?

Huh? Sri Lanka is slightly above average at 12.9 per 100,000, certainly lower than the US at 14.5 and on par with, say Sweden at 12.2

[Sculptor1]

Where is that?
That claim is also true where I live. And that is exactly why I say that there is a tendancy to drug rather than offer more expensive treatments.

Sri Lanka.

I will not speak about the private ssector since various treatment modalities will have various price tags on them. But in government sector, whether it is a drug or a counselling session or a CBT session, all these are paid not by the patient but by the government. So the only limiting factor is the availability of resources. Clinicians are not separately paid for doing counselling or CBT since it is a part of their job. And also they are not paid for seeing a huge number of patients quickly by easily prescribing drugs. So the appropriate treatments are offered to patients without charging directly from their pockets (Nothing can be free in a state and that is why we pay taxes. But I think that is a different topic and it is totally different from paying your medical bills directly from your pocket).

Sri Lanka has the highest suicide rate in the world.
So I guess your mental health services are not working too well, eh?

Huh? Sri Lanka is slightly above average at 12.9 per 100,000, certainly lower than the US at 14.5 and on par with, say Sweden at 12.2

Sadly I cannot quote my source since I am forbidden to link.

[Sy Borg]

Sri Lanka.

I will not speak about the private ssector since various treatment modalities will have various price tags on them. But in government sector, whether it is a drug or a counselling session or a CBT session, all these are paid not by the patient but by the government. So the only limiting factor is the availability of resources. Clinicians are not separately paid for doing counselling or CBT since it is a part of their job. And also they are not paid for seeing a huge number of patients quickly by easily prescribing drugs. So the appropriate treatments are offered to patients without charging directly from their pockets (Nothing can be free in a state and that is why we pay taxes. But I think that is a different topic and it is totally different from paying your medical bills directly from your pocket).

Sri Lanka has the highest suicide rate in the world.
So I guess your mental health services are not working too well, eh?

Huh? Sri Lanka is slightly above average at 12.9 per 100,000, certainly lower than the US at 14.5 and on par with, say Sweden at 12.2

Sadly I cannot quote my source since I am forbidden to link.

You could copy and paste and a reference. You could also point out that Sri Lanka's very high suicide rate (top five in the world) was spurred by agricultural chemicals.

Sri Lanka has reduced its overall suicide rate by 70% over the last two decades through means restriction, through a series of government regulations and bans removing highly hazardous pesticides from agriculture. We aimed to identify the key pesticide(s) now responsible for suicides in rural Sri Lanka to provide data for further pesticide regulation.

BMC Public Health volume 20, Article number: 780 (2020)

The above does not point to Sri Lanka having a philosophical lack, rather it suggests endemic corruption and dereliction of governmental duty in not properly regulating corporations.