Philosophy Discussion Forums

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑July 22nd, 2020, 10:45 am Miles has been part of my recent musical development. I started with rock and folk, and quickly also came to appreciate jazz-rock as part of the prog-rock scene. Much later, I discovered that there is quite a lot of classical music that I like. Like many young people, I had been put off by bigots who said that their music (classical) was the only good music, and the stuff I liked was . So I ignored them, and classical music. But now Debussy, Ravel, Chopin and Stravinsky form a regular part of my musical diet.

In recent years, especially since I retired, I've been listening to more jazz. Which brings me back to your post of Miles' Bitches Brew, a fantastic performance. I've spent the last few years discovering loads and loads of amazing music, much of it recorded before I was born. Brubeck and Paul Desmond, Art Tatum and Art Blakey, Monk and Mingus, and many others. They account for half my listening these days. My most recent discovery is Maria Schneider.

Greta wrote: ↑July 22nd, 2020, 4:32 pm Bitches Brew has some great moments. Miles Does the Voodoo Down is a wonderful thunbing of the nose to the conservative part of his audience at the time. My most recommended Miles albums would be In a Silent Way, Kind of Blue and Tutu. The first two are beautiful in the early morning, when you are still feeling a little delicate. Other wonderful mellow and complex performers you might enjoy are Pat Metheney (a personal favourite) and Swiss fusion/world music harpist Andreas Vollenveider.

Ah, this is turning out to be a trip down Memory Lane!

In the early 70s, my teenage peers were challenging each other to come up with music the others had never heard, the weirder the better. So I heard Kraan back then, although I might wish I hadn't. But one of our crew turned up one day having discovered a new record label, ECM. So, thanks to Manfred Eicher, I discovered artistes like Miroslav Vitous, Jan Garbarek and Eberhard Weber, to name but three. I first heard Pat Metheny when he was part of Joni Mitchell's band on her Shadows and Light tour. Wasn't Jaco Pastorius also part of that line-up?

AllMusic wrote:Shadows and Light is Joni Mitchell's second live album, and it serves as a good retrospective of her jazzy period from 1975-1979. As expected, she assembles a group of all-star musicians including Pat Metheny (guitar), Jaco Pastorius (bass), Lyle Mays (keyboards), and Michael Brecker (saxophone) who give these compositions more energy than on the studio recordings. The musicians are given room to jam, and they sound terrific on uptempo songs such as "Coyote" and "In France They Kiss on Main Street."

Oh yes, he was, and I'd forgotten Mays and Brecker too.

And I agree, Kind of Blue is probably my favourite by Miles. AllMusic list it as the top of their "user ratings". But I've never heard of Andreas Vollenveider before, a shortcoming I shall remedy shortly. Thanks for the tip! He sounds a bit like a jazz (?) version of Joanna Newsom....

I discovered oriental jazz pianist Hiromi a couple of years ago. Does anyone else like her, or is it just me?

Oh, and I saw Soft Machine when their (jazz) guitarist was Alan Holdsworth, whose death was announced a few days ago. RIP.

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑July 23rd, 2020, 9:10 am Oh, and I saw Soft Machine when their (jazz) guitarist was Alan Holdsworth, whose death was announced a few days ago. RIP.

Oops, it seems I was late catching on. Mr Holdsworth died in 2017. When I saw him with the Softs, I was unsure. I loved my jazz-rock, but straight jazz was still a little outside my comfort zone. But I was amused when he ripped off Jan Akkerman - the Melody-Maker Guitar-God of the moment - at double speed! The audience loved it. Those were the days! [Around 1975.]

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑July 23rd, 2020, 9:07 am

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑July 22nd, 2020, 10:45 am Miles has been part of my recent musical development. I started with rock and folk, and quickly also came to appreciate jazz-rock as part of the prog-rock scene. Much later, I discovered that there is quite a lot of classical music that I like. Like many young people, I had been put off by bigots who said that their music (classical) was the only good music, and the stuff I liked was 💩. So I ignored them, and classical music. But now Debussy, Ravel, Chopin and Stravinsky form a regular part of my musical diet.

In recent years, especially since I retired, I've been listening to more jazz. Which brings me back to your post of Miles' Bitches Brew, a fantastic performance. I've spent the last few years discovering loads and loads of amazing music, much of it recorded before I was born. Brubeck and Paul Desmond, Art Tatum and Art Blakey, Monk and Mingus, and many others. They account for half my listening these days. My most recent discovery is Maria Schneider. 🎷🥁🎹🎺🎧

Greta wrote: ↑July 22nd, 2020, 4:32 pm Bitches Brew has some great moments. Miles Does the Voodoo Down is a wonderful thunbing of the nose to the conservative part of his audience at the time. My most recommended Miles albums would be In a Silent Way, Kind of Blue and Tutu. The first two are beautiful in the early morning, when you are still feeling a little delicate. Other wonderful mellow and complex performers you might enjoy are Pat Metheney (a personal favourite) and Swiss fusion/world music harpist Andreas Vollenveider.

Ah, this is turning out to be a trip down Memory Lane! 🙂🙂🙂

In the early 70s, my teenage peers were challenging each other to come up with music the others had never heard, the weirder the better. So I heard Kraan back then, although I might wish I hadn't. 😉 But one of our crew turned up one day having discovered a new record label, ECM. So, thanks to Manfred Eicher, I discovered artistes like Miroslav Vitous, Jan Garbarek and Eberhard Weber, to name but three. I first heard Pat Metheny when he was part of Joni Mitchell's band on her Shadows and Light tour. Wasn't Jaco Pastorius also part of that line-up? 🤔

AllMusic wrote:Shadows and Light is Joni Mitchell's second live album, and it serves as a good retrospective of her jazzy period from 1975-1979. As expected, she assembles a group of all-star musicians including Pat Metheny (guitar), Jaco Pastorius (bass), Lyle Mays (keyboards), and Michael Brecker (saxophone) who give these compositions more energy than on the studio recordings. The musicians are given room to jam, and they sound terrific on uptempo songs such as "Coyote" and "In France They Kiss on Main Street."

Oh yes, he was, and I'd forgotten Mays and Brecker too. 😳

And I agree, Kind of Blue is probably my favourite by Miles. AllMusic list it as the top of their "user ratings". But I've never heard of Andreas Vollenveider before, a shortcoming I shall remedy shortly. Thanks for the tip! 👍 He sounds a bit like a jazz (?) version of Joanna Newsom....

I discovered oriental jazz pianist Hiromi a couple of years ago. Does anyone else like her, or is it just me? 🤔

Music for me is largely a trip down memory lane per se these days. I swore to myself in the 70s and 80s that I would not become intolerant of new music like my parents, but that's what has happened. I don't much care for drum machines, unless used for musical effect rather than convenience or economics.

Just checked out a live clip Kraan. Their stage sound is superb and they are easy on the ears. Nice to hear instrumental music that does not neatly fit the usual categories. There's a special beauty, sophistication and innocence to instrumental music that I don't often find in music with lyrics. So often song lyrics are dumb or crass, eg. most pop today and, when the lyrics are smart, the music is rendered dull, eg. Bob Dylan, Leonard Cohen.

An exception is Joni Mitchell, whose words easily transcend the usual, supported by music good enough to listen to in its on right - yet it never interferes or distracts from the stories she sings. The lineup she had on Shadows and Light that you listed is the cream of the crop, a band of leading bandleaders. Amazing, and a testimony to her, being able to lead a band of such rare talent.

And yes, I have seen many videos of Hiromi performing with Anthony Jackson and Simon Phillips. She is a freak of nature, which strangely seems to be a thing with young Japanese women. I will never forget seeing a video of Senri Kawaguchi playing drums at age 11. At the time I'd played drums for decades and this little slip of a thing could do more with one limb than I could do with four. Bloody child prodigies *grumble* :lol:

I'd not heard of Joanna Newsom. She reminds me of Kate Bush. Quite original.

You may not like the genre.
But you cannot deny the
skill and musicianship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfC36XZ ... r1L9I6SPeQ

Sculptor1 wrote: ↑July 23rd, 2020, 6:47 pm You may not like the genre.
But you cannot deny the
skill and musicianship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfC36XZ ... r1L9I6SPeQ

Marco Minneman is a monster player, capable of playing different meters with different limbs.

Here's some more players with great chops, but in a far mellower setting :)

Greta wrote: ↑July 24th, 2020, 2:17 am

Sculptor1 wrote: ↑July 23rd, 2020, 6:47 pm You may not like the genre.
But you cannot deny the
skill and musicianship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfC36XZ ... r1L9I6SPeQ

Marco Minneman is a monster player, capable of playing different meters with different limbs.

Here's some more players with great chops, but in a far mellower setting

Thanks for that.
Reminded me of Roy Harper.
I hate one man and his guitar. All those camp fires when some clown gets out his six string to spoil the mood. But even on TV, so little is remarkable enough for me to be interested, and I hate the attempt at emotional manipulation EXCEPT - the guy that does it well - Harper.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2DwPhnxTNI

The last word in one man and his guitar

I have seen Richard Thompson on stage, playing a track I assumed was heavily multi-tracked ... but he played it live, all of it, at the same time. I was stunned. One man and his guitar. [A bit like Tony Levin playing his Chapman stick.]

I always admired David Crosby for his mustache-style continuity, and refusal to waft on the winds of mustache fashion.

I remember that the thing I most liked about the song "In The Year 2525" was that, unlike most futuristic fiction, it placed its predictions a sensibly long way in the future. At about the same time, "2001: A Space Odyssey" was making far fetched predictions about what would happen only 32 years later. I've always found it surprising that futuristic fiction tends to be so short-sighted. After all, it's easy enough to cover yourself by adding an extra zero or a few hundred years.

"Space 1999", made in the 70's, was the most ridiculous example of this. They might as well have called it "Space a week on Tuesday".

So, when the song says "in the year 4545 you won't need your teeth of your eyes", that's much more believable. A sensible, modest prediction.

Steve, that reminds me of how Blade Runner's flying cars occur in 2019. If you are after accurate predictions of the future, I recommend The Simpsons or South Park :)