Philosophy Discussion Forums | A Humans-Only Club for Open-Minded Discussion & Debate

[Belindi]

I cannot prove that Santa does not exist.

Can anyone?

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors. Nevertheless the folk stories are still immensely appealing and make people feel good.The Chrismas stories are built around the theme of hope. Hope has always been a human need at dark times of the seasonal cycle and of human affairs.

It may not be possible for Australians to get the feel of the dark cold dreich season of winter , when in the northern hemisphere people killed surplus and unsustainable livestock and ate it up in a huge cheerful feast.

[3017Metaphysician]

I cannot prove that Santa does not exist.

Can anyone?

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Cool! Did he tell you that he existed?

[EricPH]

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors.

If God has the power to create the universe and life, then he has the power to edit the Bible in the way he intends. The editors will be human, but God is in control. Jesus walked on water, some may see this as a myth. I believe God has the power to do this, after all it's a minor miracle compared to the creation of the universe and life.

Nevertheless the folk stories are still immensely appealing and make people feel good.The Chrismas stories are built around the theme of hope. Hope has always been a human need at dark times of the seasonal cycle and of human affairs.

Beliefs can be meaningless, unless they inspire us to do something. I find a great sense of peace and hope, I also feel inspired to do more in our community.

[Belindi]

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors.

If God has the power to create the universe and life, then he has the power to edit the Bible in the way he intends. The editors will be human, but God is in control. Jesus walked on water, some may see this as a myth. I believe God has the power to do this, after all it's a minor miracle compared to the creation of the universe and life.

Nevertheless the folk stories are still immensely appealing and make people feel good.The Chrismas stories are built around the theme of hope. Hope has always been a human need at dark times of the seasonal cycle and of human affairs.

Beliefs can be meaningless, unless they inspire us to do something. I find a great sense of peace and hope, I also feel inspired to do more in our community.

What you write, Eric, is true for you and many other good people. But it's not philosophy.

[Count Lucanor]

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors.

If God has the power to create the universe and life, then he has the power to edit the Bible in the way he intends.

It is strange, though, that he intended the Bible to show that he has not much power to change things, that he often forgets, makes mistakes, promotes inmorality and doesn't even care to make the whole story consistent, without contradictions. I guess he is so humble that chose to appear mediocre.

[EricPH]

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors.

If God has the power to create the universe and life, then he has the power to edit the Bible in the way he intends. The editors will be human, but God is in control. Jesus walked on water, some may see this as a myth. I believe God has the power to do this, after all it's a minor miracle compared to the creation of the universe and life.

Nevertheless the folk stories are still immensely appealing and make people feel good.The Chrismas stories are built around the theme of hope. Hope has always been a human need at dark times of the seasonal cycle and of human affairs.

Beliefs can be meaningless, unless they inspire us to do something. I find a great sense of peace and hope, I also feel inspired to do more in our community.

What you write, Eric, is true for you and many other good people.

If you see this as a truth, then why would you have any problem with it?

But it's not philosophy.

We don't do philosophy any favours if we just sit and ponder life's questions; without trying to do something. Surely the best way to use philosophy, is to try and use it for a good purpose.

[Sy Borg]

I cannot prove that Santa does not exist.

Can anyone?

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Cool! Did he tell you that he existed?

Yes, he came to me and spoke to me. He told me that I had been a good-ish girl but, due to my lack of interest in material goods, I won't be receiving any presents, in accordance with my wishes. Later on, I got to speak with Santa, and he agreed.

[Belindi]

I think Biblical scholars say the Christmas story is a collection of folk myths that were inserted into The Bible by editors.

If God has the power to create the universe and life, then he has the power to edit the Bible in the way he intends. The editors will be human, but God is in control. Jesus walked on water, some may see this as a myth. I believe God has the power to do this, after all it's a minor miracle compared to the creation of the universe and life.

Nevertheless the folk stories are still immensely appealing and make people feel good.The Chrismas stories are built around the theme of hope. Hope has always been a human need at dark times of the seasonal cycle and of human affairs.

Beliefs can be meaningless, unless they inspire us to do something. I find a great sense of peace and hope, I also feel inspired to do more in our community.

What you write, Eric, is true for you and many other good people.

If you see this as a truth, then why would you have any problem with it?

But it's not philosophy.

We don't do philosophy any favours if we just sit and ponder life's questions; without trying to do something. Surely the best way to use philosophy, is to try and use it for a good purpose.

Good work without philosophy is the norm. Moral philosophy is for reasoning whether or not a work is really good and in what way it's good. Scepticism, which informs and guides philosophers, is also a good guide for moral action.
Untruth and lies can invade the best of intentions.

[Mounce574]

I cannot prove that Santa does not exist.

Can anyone?

I saw both God and Jesus yesterday. True or false?

Me too. And Santa was talking with them. There's always an increase in sightings of those guys around Christmastime.

Santa "Clause" did exist.

Saint Nicholas was known for his generosity and kindness, which gave rise to legends of miracles he performed for the poor and unhappy. As a result of this reputation, devotion to Nicholas extended to all parts of Europe. He became the patron saint of multiple countries, of charitable fraternities and guilds, and of children, sailors, unmarried girls, merchants, and pawnbrokers.

Jesus existed as well
There are records, outside of the Bible that speak of Jesus- this includes Greek scholars and Roman soldiers
First, both Josephus and Lucian indicate that Jesus was regarded as wise. Second, Pliny, the Talmud, and Lucian imply He was a powerful and revered teacher. Third, both Josephus and the Talmud indicate He performed miraculous feats. Fourth, Tacitus, Josephus, the Talmud, and Lucian all mention that He was crucified. Tacitus and Josephus say this occurred under Pontius Pilate. And the Talmud declares it happened on the eve of Passover. Fifth, there are possible references to the Christian belief in Jesus' resurrection in both Tacitus and Josephus. Sixth, Josephus records that Jesus' followers believed He was the Christ, or Messiah. And finally, both Pliny and Lucian indicate that Christians worshipped Jesus as God.

[Sy Borg]

If they each did exist as historical figures, fine. However, their modern representations posit them as absurd superheroes.

The miracles did not happen. The virgin birth did not happen. The resurrection did not happen. 100%.

[EricPH]

If they each did exist as historical figures, fine. However, their modern representations posit them as absurd superheroes.

The miracles did not happen. The virgin birth did not happen. The resurrection did not happen. 100%.

Even you believe that life came from no life, and you don't know how this could happen. Sounds a total myth to me without God.

[Sy Borg]

If they each did exist as historical figures, fine. However, their modern representations posit them as absurd superheroes.

The miracles did not happen. The virgin birth did not happen. The resurrection did not happen. 100%.

Even you believe that life came from no life, and you don't know how this could happen. Sounds a total myth to me without God.

This is the wrong way to look at it, as if life and non-life are opposites. I blame this on our usual use of language, which wrongly treats "life" and "biology" as exactly the same. This underestimates the order within many supposedly non-living entities, which share many aspects of biology, just not all of them. The difference between the first life and that which preceded it would have been small.

You don't need magic or phantasms to create life. If you are genuinely interested in the subject rather than just playing the old theist game of superficially trying to use science against itself, you will take in the content of this video. It's excellent, probably better postulating how abiogenesis came about than anything else I'm come across:

[EricPH]

If you are genuinely interested in the subject rather than just playing the old theist game of superficially trying to use science against itself, you will take in the content of this video. It's excellent, probably better postulating how abiogenesis came about than anything else I'm come across:

What does science/evolution inspire or encourage you to do?

Belief in God has given me a profound sense of peace; when I was diagnosed with the same cancer that killed our friend.

My mum went into a coma and was rushed to hospital, her breathing was a horrible gurgling sound. The doctors said there was nothing they could do for her, she had days to live. A priest came and prayed for her, her breathing relaxed and she lived another eleven years.

Belief in God has taught me to forgive, This has been a profound journey towards finding peace.

I have been a volunteer Street Pastor for nearly fifteen years, faith and trust in God has helped me find peace whilst being in the middle of angry drunken violence at three in the morning. Faith in God helps me to search for the good in all people, even in dark and testing times.

Faith in God gives me reasons to be thankful.

Faith in God gives me hope in a greater good life after death.

What more could I gain; if I gave up faith and trust in God?

[Charlemagne]

Francois Rabelais, Writer

“Science without conscience is the death of the soul.”

But how does science acquire a conscience without reference to the God of Abraham?

Clearly, the inventors of nuclear weapons never consulted that God.

[Sy Borg]

If you are genuinely interested in the subject rather than just playing the old theist game of superficially trying to use science against itself, you will take in the content of this video. It's excellent, probably better postulating how abiogenesis came about than anything else I'm come across:

What does science/evolution inspire or encourage you to do?

Belief in God has given me a profound sense of peace; when I was diagnosed with the same cancer that killed our friend.

My mum went into a coma and was rushed to hospital, her breathing was a horrible gurgling sound. The doctors said there was nothing they could do for her, she had days to live. A priest came and prayed for her, her breathing relaxed and she lived another eleven years.

Belief in God has taught me to forgive, This has been a profound journey towards finding peace.

I have been a volunteer Street Pastor for nearly fifteen years, faith and trust in God has helped me find peace whilst being in the middle of angry drunken violence at three in the morning. Faith in God helps me to search for the good in all people, even in dark and testing times.

Faith in God gives me reasons to be thankful.

Faith in God gives me hope in a greater good life after death.

What more could I gain; if I gave up faith and trust in God?

Yes yes, we are all aware that you committed philosophical suicide long ago, abandoning reason for a warm and safe placebo. I choose not to take the easy way out of life, preferring to face the absurdity of being a creature that seeks meaning in an uncaring universe rather that hiding behind a veil of sweet lies.

Whatever, this thread is not about the benefits of positive thinking or the placebo effect. It's very clear that the God meme has been efficacious in terms of survival and fecundity, hence its continued existence. But the question is not about whether societal customs and belief systems are efficacious, but whether they are ontic or subjective. ALL evidence points to the latter, and strongly.

It's ironic that theists, who claim not to be materialists, are dismissive of the subjective realm, and thus refuse the idea that their deity exists in human brains - brains inherited from thousands of ancestors who all believed in agency lying behind natural phenomena. This way of perceiving the world has proved to be so efficacious that the world is now overpopulated with humans, endangering all other sophisticated animals.

Essentially, religion acts as a means of blocking out large amounts of reality so as to focus on human complexities. Religions and customs act as mental filters that further reduce information already filtered by the senses. By contrast, in science and philosophy, the aim is to perceive ever more of reality rather than block it out. The perception is done for its own sake, rather than being akin to theistic goal-seeking.

Very broadly (noting that there are always exceptions) science is about worship of the universe while religion is about the worship of humanity, ie. deities posited as superhumans. Science seeks to engage, understand and preserve the non-human, while theists see the non-human as mere props in the important business of human affairs to be exploited and destroyed as they see fit.