Philosophy Discussion Forums | A Humans-Only Club for Open-Minded Discussion & Debate

[Sy Borg]

It's an art I am still learning. To have someone snipe unfairly and not react.

Generally, I don't GAF about propriety or rules of engagement, more the spirit in which it is conducted, and the originality, cohesiveness, eloquence or perceptiveness of responses.

[gad-fly]

When I first joined a forum in 2020, I presumed that it would be 'chatting' about ideas. I was fortunate that the first discussions which I got involved people who were fairly flexible. That is how I engage about ideas in real life. I was rather surprised when several months later that I discovered many people on that forum to be rather dogmatic in the way they were approaching ideas, independently of the content of the ideas themselves.

Right. The forum is about chatting ideas, translated loosely as 'philosophy'. But it takes all sorts to constitute society. Be prepared for pleasure and pain when you joint. Put it this way: don't expect a free lunch.

having gone this far since the inception of this topic, I presume it is time to realize that discussion on Forum Reform, as titled, would stay on no more than the discussion level, at best. Nevertheless, it has been fruitful.

[JackDaydream]

When I first joined a forum in 2020, I presumed that it would be 'chatting' about ideas. I was fortunate that the first discussions which I got involved people who were fairly flexible. That is how I engage about ideas in real life. I was rather surprised when several months later that I discovered many people on that forum to be rather dogmatic in the way they were approaching ideas, independently of the content of the ideas themselves.

Right. The forum is about chatting ideas, translated loosely as 'philosophy'. But it takes all sorts to constitute society. Be prepared for pleasure and pain when you joint. Put it this way: don't expect a free lunch.

having gone this far since the inception of this topic, I presume it is time to realize that discussion on Forum Reform, as titled, would stay on no more than the discussion level, at best. Nevertheless, it has been fruitful.

It sounds like you are disappointed that nothing has happened beyond discussion. I do understand your frustration about the way in which topics fade so quickly. But it is also about the issue of what happens to topics when they are in sections rather than in the five at the top. Some which have caught on go on for months and months. It may seem that there is not much interaction but it may be that it is going on in threads which are about 40 or 50 pages long. I guess that these are what are considered to be the 'successful' ones although I have to admit that I rarely follow these.

It is probably like most aspects of social reality, where there are mainstream and fringe aspects. What I am saying is that it may be that there are hidden gems in corners barely noticed. I often look at older threads which have barely had any replies. So, in a way, no threads or posts are lost but are like secret underground passages which may be discovered by explorers.

[gad-fly]

It sounds like you are disappointed that nothing has happened beyond discussion. I do understand your frustration about the way in which topics fade so quickly. But it is also about the issue of what happens to topics when they are in sections rather than in the five at the top. Some which have caught on go on for months and months. It may seem that there is not much interaction but it may be that it is going on in threads which are about 40 or 50 pages long. I guess that these are what are considered to be the 'successful' ones although I have to admit that I rarely follow these.

It is probably like most aspects of social reality, where there are mainstream and fringe aspects. What I am saying is that it may be that there are hidden gems in corners barely noticed. I often look at older threads which have barely had any replies. So, in a way, no threads or posts are lost but are like secret underground passages which may be discovered by explorers.

I am disappointed? I would not put it that way. Frankly, if indeed I am, it is not relevant. This is a site I can come and go, so to speak, in the pursuit of happiness.

I raise this topic of Forum Reform because it is such a waste to have the forum serving to dispose in the present manner. The cost benefit analysis is way out of proportion. What is its mission, or rather, what is its intent and purpose? Surely not a chatting platform for the maddening crowd, the more louder the merrier, the more ridiculous the more entertaining, but rather, a serious arena for deep and soaked thinking and insight.

[JackDaydream]

It sounds like you are disappointed that nothing has happened beyond discussion. I do understand your frustration about the way in which topics fade so quickly. But it is also about the issue of what happens to topics when they are in sections rather than in the five at the top. Some which have caught on go on for months and months. It may seem that there is not much interaction but it may be that it is going on in threads which are about 40 or 50 pages long. I guess that these are what are considered to be the 'successful' ones although I have to admit that I rarely follow these.

It is probably like most aspects of social reality, where there are mainstream and fringe aspects. What I am saying is that it may be that there are hidden gems in corners barely noticed. I often look at older threads which have barely had any replies. So, in a way, no threads or posts are lost but are like secret underground passages which may be discovered by explorers.

I am disappointed? I would not put it that way. Frankly, if indeed I am, it is not relevant. This is a site I can come and go, so to speak, in the pursuit of happiness.

I raise this topic of Forum Reform because it is such a waste to have the forum serving to dispose in the present manner. The cost benefit analysis is way out of proportion. What is its mission, or rather, what is its intent and purpose? Surely not a chatting platform for the maddening crowd, the more louder the merrier, the more ridiculous the more entertaining, but rather, a serious arena for deep and soaked thinking and insight.

I have only used forums for a year and a half, so I am still learning how it all works, especially comparing the dynamics of this one with the first one. I am inclined to the serious kind of philosophy thinking. I will probably always read and it does seem that people come from very different approaches. At the moment, I try to make best use of the forum because it does provide a basis for some kind of interaction and, definitely, some of it seems worthwhile. In some ways, it is good that there aren't hundreds of users because the 5 new posts would probably last only a few hours. As it is I created a thread only 24 hours ago approx and it has already gone down to 4th down on the list, so it will probably vanish from there tomorrow. Once they go out of the 5 some continue and some die completely. It does seem so disappointing when a topic cannot stay in the new ones for more than about 2 days. I do wish to join in others threads and I don't want to keep creating them and try not to be repetitive in subject matter. But, yes, it is about finding the discussions which are meaningful and focusing on them. This thread has become quite a long one as it's now in its 4th page and I am aware that I write in a lot and its probably because I do find that the forum provokes a lot of emotions for me and having some kind of outlet for discussion of it helps. So, I like this thread. It is a bit like a community meeting space.

[gad-fly]

So, I like this thread. It is a bit like a community meeting space.

This thread may serve as a sitting duck. Go on, starting shooting with whatever anyone finds wrong with the forum. The only request is that the complaint should be accompanied by a note on what improvement/reform can be brought along. it is never my intention to create something simply to allow letting off steam.

Sadly, after so many pages, nothing has yet been attained.

it is comforting to believe that this forum will continue to exist on its own ground.

[gad-fly]

The stage is set. Anyone carrying a New Topic can have it put to top of five Recent Topics, by displacing the last on the list. The merry-go-round would have it kicked out in a day or two, not to be seen again unless with active effort searching.

In the meantime, all are invited to join in, to watch the show, or even to go up the stage.

Added to the fun, it does not make any difference what the New Topic title is. It can be as idiotic, silly, ridiculous, or hopefully, philosophical. Gingerly, all will be classified as Philosophy.

As someone has said years ago: Everyone will be famous for five minutes. Fair? No. This has nothing to do with fairness. No discrimination of a scrabbling kid against Picasso. Some audience or viewer may consider it insulting his intelligence, and may exit the minute he enters the theatre. Some, like me, will advocate Reform before it is too late. Some will simply give up, sooner rather than later. What about you?

[JackDaydream]

The stage is set. Anyone carrying a New Topic can have it put to top of five Recent Topics, by displacing the last on the list. The merry-go-round would have it kicked out in a day or two, not to be seen again unless with active effort searching.

In the meantime, all are invited to join in, to watch the show, or even to go up the stage.

Added to the fun, it does not make any difference what the New Topic title is. It can be as idiotic, silly, ridiculous, or hopefully, philosophical. Gingerly, all will be classified as Philosophy.

As someone has said years ago: Everyone will be famous for five minutes. Fair? No. This has nothing to do with fairness. No discrimination of a scrabbling kid against Picasso. Some audience or viewer may consider it insulting his intelligence, and may exit the minute he enters the theatre. Some, like me, will advocate Reform before it is too late. Some will simply give up, sooner rather than later. What about you?

Perhaps it is like the law of natural selection, as in competition. The art may be about creating a thread which can endure for a certain amount of time. I am pleased if my threads get 100 replies. There is an element of luck and my last one got kicked out of the top 5 within 36 hours of creating it but it did at least get to the figure of 25 if nothing else. It also depends who logs on or whether points for lengthy debate arise.

While I share your feelings about threads seeming to evaporate overnight, I am not sure that changes to the rules about the creation of threads would help any of us. That is because as it is there is scope to wake up with an idea and explore it with others in various aspects of the world. I don't know about you, but I find forum threads as being about the only platform which I have for writing and sharing ideas. So, I am grateful for it.

I know that you have an idea about fixed threads which people add to it, but it could be so boring. Also, who would write them or be selected as the chosen threads. It could be extremely elitist. It would be a bit like blogs where you read it and write comments. I would certainly stop using the site If it meant not being able to create new threads but I do try to be mindful of creating them too often because it can be tempting. I see them as little projects and find it exciting to try to come up with new angles, but I am hoping for some deep interaction.

[gad-fly]

I know that you have an idea about fixed threads which people add to it, but it could be so boring.

Threads like: What is Art? What is Science? Creation, Creator. Some may find them boring, but interest will never dry up, You wake up and, without knowing, you may discover a different idea. Ideas will evolve after one night, or after twenty years. Who do you shares it with? Make it welcomed here, with an open arm, and not anytime soon.

Threads like the Trump Presidency, Do you agree with this author? They become stale. interest may be strong, but partial, and soon stale. Mix them up, and you can fill your belly, but that is about it. Reminds me of the commune in the Cultural Revolution, when people were ants. We deserve better.

[Angelo Cannata]

What about having a voting system in the forum, both for messages and for members? There might be even separate sections for members or threads that reach a certain grade by votes, or likes, similar to the likes on facebook. This way people who don't like low quality messages would have a restricted space for high quality stuff.
And what about organizing online zoom meetings?

[gad-fly]

What about having a voting system in the forum, both for messages and for members? There might be even separate sections for members or threads that reach a certain grade by votes, or likes, similar to the likes on facebook. This way people who don't like low quality messages would have a restricted space for high quality stuff.
And what about organizing online zoom meetings?

For quite a while, the Forum has been leaking participative support and audience. I hope I am wrong, but I can see indicative footprints of its demise. It would be sad.

I welcome your suggestion of some voting system. We should be open to serious ideas. My suggestion: Divide Recent Topics into two categories: Transient and Perpetual. five each, followed separately by five book club discussion. How to distinguish Transient from Perpetual can be considered by Scott and Moderators later, as a separate issue.

[Angelo Cannata]

The decay of forums is unfortunately a general issue all over the world; social media have killed forums. My suggestion came from my experience that not rarely I abandon discussions because of messages that put noise and distraction inthe discussion.
What about organizing Zoom meetings, in addition to the space of written discussions in the forum?

[JackDaydream]

The decay of forums is unfortunately a general issue all over the world; social media have killed forums. My suggestion came from my experience that not rarely I abandon discussions because of messages that put noise and distraction inthe discussion.
What about organizing Zoom meetings, in addition to the space of written discussions in the forum?

Having Zoom on the site would alter it completely. Some may like it, although I will admit that I probably wouldn't participate in Zoom interaction because I dislike Zoom. It is not that I wouldn't like to see and hear the people I am engaging with. But, talking on Zoom seems too much of a performance. In real life, people speak rather than write. Speaking and writing are different ways of communicating. Some people are more confident than others in public performance but Zoom seems, from my point of view, to incorporate the worst aspects of communication. It is impersonal in a way, like writing. However, it demands the spontaneity of face to face interaction.

Also, if Zoom was part of the site, I don't know how it would work because posts remain and would it mean that the Zoom meetings would be recorded for people to respond to? If they were at specific times, it would be hard to juggle times as people are in different countries. It might mean people getting up in the middle of the night for the meetings.

[gad-fly]

Since I have my other much more active website, OnlineBookClub.org, I am able to let this much smaller website use that website's vast resources at essentially no charge.

I pay over $800 per month for the server I have it on currently, so in theory at least the forum software should run fast and reliably. The server has a 16-core CPU and 64GB of RAM. I don't think it would run well on, for example, a $5 per month shared web host, especially considering those are generally always oversold (i.e. running over capacity). There are a lot of other concerns like the SSL certificate, the IP address, the MX records, just to name a few of the top of my head. Cheap shared hosts either don't offer these kind of features or charge extra for them. Plus, someone has to set them up and manage all that which can take quite a bit of technical knowledge. I think I put a lot more time into this website than people realize, which is itself part of the reason I don't have as much time as I would like to log in as a regular user and join in on the actual discussions, which I do enjoy very much when I can find the time.

Today, June 6, 2022, being D-Day, one can see all five Recent Topics and all five Book of the Month Topics posted by one person: Sushan.

May I suggest this imbalance posts a strong call for Reform of the present platform, to make the spending worth the trouble, and to re-invigorate philosophical interest?

[JackDaydream]

Since I have my other much more active website, OnlineBookClub.org, I am able to let this much smaller website use that website's vast resources at essentially no charge.

I pay over $800 per month for the server I have it on currently, so in theory at least the forum software should run fast and reliably. The server has a 16-core CPU and 64GB of RAM. I don't think it would run well on, for example, a $5 per month shared web host, especially considering those are generally always oversold (i.e. running over capacity). There are a lot of other concerns like the SSL certificate, the IP address, the MX records, just to name a few of the top of my head. Cheap shared hosts either don't offer these kind of features or charge extra for them. Plus, someone has to set them up and manage all that which can take quite a bit of technical knowledge. I think I put a lot more time into this website than people realize, which is itself part of the reason I don't have as much time as I would like to log in as a regular user and join in on the actual discussions, which I do enjoy very much when I can find the time.

Today, June 6, 2022, being D-Day, one can see all five Recent Topics and all five Book of the Month Topics posted by one person: Sushan.

May I suggest this imbalance posts a strong call for Reform of the present platform, to make the spending worth the trouble, and to re-invigorate philosophical interest?

I am afraid that I am writing in your thread because I am feeling so despondent about using the forum at the moment. It may seem that I am happy because I create loads of threads but it is only because it seems hard to create a thread which lasts more than a few days. However, it is not simply that people are only interested in the top 5 but that threads which are years old or over 50 pages long are often the ones which are being replied to most.

It could be that the threads and outposts are considered as brilliant and even though I do get a fair amount of replies to some of mine. I am sure that my threads are not in any way comparable to the ones which keep going. I probably wouldn't join in the discussions on these because they are so long and it would almost seem like intruding at this stage. Also, these long threads are so repetitive.

For this reason, I do create a lot of threads and I am really wishing to change the slants a little and try out ideas which haven't had much attention. However, if I try writing anything a little different whether it is about the ideas of William Blake or shamanism I realise that it is unlikely that it will get much of a response. But, it does seem to all come back to the perennial questions of philosophy and, of course, human beings ask these questions. I wonder if I am expecting too much from the forum and it is hard to avoid a certain amount of repetition.

The problem as far as I see is about how often it is only a couple that threads which are getting lots of responses, often in response to someone who appears provocative or annoying. I wonder if this is what drives many people away, as it makes the forum seem like a clique. I do read a lot of threads which I don't reply to and what seems to be happening is that people are discussing similar discussions in various threads, as if they are in little houses or in different tongues, like the Tower of Babel. It all seems fragmented. I have stuck around and do still try to find worthwhile interaction but others may simply give up on the site entirely.